NASACR's decision on Carl Edwards' actions against Keselowski at Atlanta: three race probation. Really?
by 4ever3 on Mar 9, 2010 11:29 PM EST
37 comments
I will never understand NASCAR's policing of its drivers. Carl Edwards gets a three race probation (only in the Cup series too) for deliberately wrecking Brad Keselowski in last Sunday's race at about 190 mph causing Keselowski to get airborne and fly into the outside retaining wall and catch fence upside down landing hard on the driver's side A - pillar.
Officially Edwards was found to be in violation of Section 12-1 (actions detrimental to stock car racing - aggressive driving) of the 2010 NASCAR rule book.
Now granted having Keselowski flying through the air with the greatest of ease was not what Edwards intended to happen, all he wanted to do was just spin Keselowski out and into the grass but unfortunately things at 190 mph don't always go as planned.
Mike Helton explained NASCAR's position regarding this incident; "We made it very clear to [Edwards] that these actions were not acceptable and did go beyond what we said back in January, about putting the driving back in the hands of the drivers. I believe [Edwards] understands our position at this point."
Helton went on to explain; "I think first of all, I'll go back to the fact that we parked Carl as soon as the [Atlanta] incident occurred, for the balance of the event," Helton said. "You can look back at the incidents at Homestead [Denny Hamlin wrecking Keselowski, Tony Stewart wrecking Juan Montoya] where it was a one-lap penalty.
"So the immediate reaction [to Edwards' move] from NASCAR was parking the car for the balance of the event. That in its own can be a serious reaction from us, I think. The balance of it, I think, will still have to be sorted out among the drivers as to what their opinion or their interpretation of all of this is. - Dave Rodman nascar.com.
My initial response to the three race Sprint Cup only probation and NASCAR's explanation of it was;
"Oh come on Mike (Helton) there were like what, five laps left? And Carl only lost one position due to his 'parking' because he was so many laps down anyway. Yep that's a harsh penalty. I can see how that makes a significant impact on Carl in the standings, man he is going to suffer because of that (said with much sarcasm)."
Please Note: Expletive content has been edited for publishing.
So let me see Carl was running about 38th when this happened and lost only one place as a result of being parked which cost him 8 driver points while Brad was running 5th when Carl hit him causing him to finish 36th and potentially losing Brad 105 points.
I'm sorry, I feel that the punishment does not suit the crime here. I understand that NASCAR wants the drivers to work these things out, but come on even parents who want their kids to solve their own issues between themselves need to discipline their children when they cross the line so they know right from wrong.
I'll conceed to what Aarron had to say in that Edwards has lost more than points in the court of public opinion, especially with the fans, is a more than fair assessment of this mess but what kind of message does NASCAR's ruling send to the other drivers? Go ahead boys hit each other all you want as long as you don't intend to send each other airborne, hurt each other, etc.?
Standards must be set and examples must be made, but in this case low standards were set and an ineffective example was made.
As I said the other day; "Which is it going to be? Have at it boys or Have havoc boys?"
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Disagree
If Nascar didn’t bring the hammer down on Denny Hamlin for what he did to Keselowski at Homestead in the Nationwide race last year (video) they couldn’t penalize Carl more here without loseing all credability in my book.
Remember, they let Denny get off that easy before they announced this “have at it boys” policy. Could the drivers ever really trust Nascar again when they said they want them to be more aggressive if they gave Carl a bigger punishment for this incident?
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 3:17 AM EST reply actions
On the bright side
we now get to watch Carl and Brad battle for the Nationwide Championship all season long. That ought to be reeeeeeeeaaallly interesting.
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 3:21 AM EST reply actions
We must agree to Disagree then
They parked Ted Musgrave for essentially the same thing at Martinsville in the truck race. If they did that to him then should ahve done it to Denny and to Carl.
And if there is an imaginary line to cross then they should show what happens to those when they cross it. This isn’t even a slap on the wrist. Its about being accountable for your actions (intended or otherwise) and all this is showing is that there is no accountibility for your actions (intended or otherwise).
I think you are talking about the incident at Milwaukee in 2007 with Musgrave
I don’t ever remember him getting parked at Martinsville. If this is the incident you are reffering to, there a few things that need to be futher investigated.
1) This was the first in the at that time 12 year history of the Truck series that a driver had ever been parked for a race so a precident had not been set here.
2) When he wrecked Kelly Bires he did it under caution. I think Nascar feels that wrecking someone under caution is worse than wrecking someone under green (and I agree with them) because you could injure the safety workers cleaning up the track.
3) This occured in 2007; a time when Nascar was really clamping down on drivers. Now Nascar realized that was bad for the sport and is trying to get driver to loosen up. I think the rules have changed in the last three years.
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 4:12 PM EST up reply actions
Oh and here's the kicker about the Musgrave suspension from the trucks for a race in 2007
Do you know who the replacement driver was? None other than Brad Keselowski!!!! Am i the only one that finds that weird?
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 4:16 PM EST up reply actions
NASCAR parked Harvick
for a Cup race for agressive driving during a truck race under green flag conditions. Precident set since it was before the Musgrave incident. That was at Martinsville. Although Harvick then came down pit road and parked his truck in front of the NASCAR trailer.
Oh didn’t Carl come down Pit Road the wrong way during the caution period after he was told to park it, wouldn’t that put anyone on pit road in danger as they would be looking the other way for cars coming down the proper way?
I think the Harvick incident was more Nascar
saying “oh yeah we’ll show you” to Harvick. I remember reading that Nascar was really upset about Harvick parking right in front of the Narcar trailor and basicly wanted to send him a message that that was not acceptable. It was more about harvick disrespecting authority than what happened on the racetrack.
I agree that driving backwards down pit road was unacceptable.
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 8:26 PM EST up reply actions
I really like the way Kyle Petty articulated his point
Where he said Sports have set rules and that NASCAR is making themselves look like a sideshow with the inconsistency of their rulings
Bad pick Peyton "Regular Season" Manning!!!
They have put themselves in a position now that no matter what they do they will be inconsistent
However if you look at the recent decision they have made, they are consistent with their “have at it boys” policy.
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 11, 2010 9:17 PM EST up reply actions
Well at least they are consistently inconsistent :-)
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 11, 2010 9:47 PM EST up reply actions
What do you wan them to do?
Are tehy supposed to suspend one of their more popular drivers because some loser wants to get his name out there? Someone needed to put their foot down and that foot was Carl… Time to move on. No story here. Just a little retaliation.
Maybe NASCAR felt Keselowski deserved it?
I sure haven’t heard from too many (active) drivers outraged about this. That Scott Speed 12 out of 12 interview was pretty telling that Kes was going to get dumped soon and no one on the track appreciates his style of racing (over aggressive like the 30th lap is the 300th lap.)
So, maybe because of the individuals involved, it changed the penalty.
Education is what you get from reading the directions. Experience is what you get from not reading them.
I think this is spot on.
If Carl would have done this to pretty much anyone else, the story might be different here.
The lack of driver outrage says a lot. They interviewed David Reutimann locally here, and he basically said without saying that the drivers agree Kes had it coming.
I can also concede that Carl Edwards has damaged his own reputation a lot. The fact that he kept being named in news outlets that don’t normally cover NASCAR means a lot. Non-fans and casual fans will remember this, and you better believe that sponsors will, too. I’m expecting to see him in fewer commercials.
That said, I think the punishment is really light. It’s like, imagine an office where the atmosphere was getting way too controlling and tight. Now the boss tells the staff that they can now get a pen out of the supply closet without permission, they don’t have to use an “official” font on their reports anymore, and they can date a co-worker as long as neither party is a supervisor to the other. Does that mean the staff may now steal money from the company, plagiarize reports, and sexually harass vendors? Of course not. There’s loosening up, and then there’s anarchy. NASCAR needs to find a balance.
Also, in this case, I think the potential for harm to the fans and to other drivers should have been taken into account, and it wasn’t.
"Darling, you say Brooks Orpik 'checked' that guy. He did not 'get under him and put him into the wall'."--Beloved to me, Winter 2007
Cocktails With the Penguins, where Pens fans toast victories and drown defeats.
What commercials will we not be seeing carl edwards in?
I think this may make him even more marketable, maybe not for fair play PSA’s, but for Scott’s, Nascar Hometracks, Gillete Young Guns, AFLAC, Men’s Health….I can’t see them having a huge problem with this. I could even see AFLAC bringing this up in a commercial (You never know what will happen, insurance add, something)
I’m not sure where you are going with your office scenario. But NASCAR does need to draw a line. I guess they don’t think that warrants a suspension. This may be biased becuase Edwards is a driver I like, I don’t have a problem with the severity (or non-severity) of the penalty NASCAR handed down.
I agree 100%
Carl’s stock went through the roof. He had guts to do what many others wanted to do!
Happy Days are here again The sky is all ways BLUE again Happy days are here again !
What AFLAC really needs to do
is get Brad and Carl in a commercial together talking about extended workplace health/disability coverage while showing hi-lights of the two wrecking each other. What a bonding moment that would be. Group hug everyone!
Aw that's no fun
Controversy sells! Always has, always will.
You can’t tell the Nationwide Championship battle hasn’t gotten a whole lot more interesting because of this incident.
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 8:28 PM EST up reply actions
There should be a "me" between tell and the
"Baseball, it is said, is only a game. True. And the Grand Canyon is only a hole in Arizona." - George F. Will
by RhodeIslandRoxfan on Mar 10, 2010 10:17 PM EST up reply actions
Keselowski is the one craving attention
Carl is doing fine in that department (2nd largest deal as far as sponsors go). BK is trying to make a name for himself at Carl’s expense. Don’t let that no talent ass clown affect your thinking… This is the second time BK as wrecked Carl and both of the races were possible victories for Carl. Also Keselowski has said that he want to win dirty http://www.nascar.com/2010/news/headlines/cup/01/28/bkeselowski.penske.reputation/story_single.html
by pollynole on Mar 11, 2010 2:34 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I sure hope Edwards is ok after his injury. I mean he just got his Wrist lightly slapped. What a travesy!
(LOL) Ya I think he is having
a special brace made for his wrist so he can drive at Bristol next week (lol again).
Lost all respect for Edwards.
What a classless move on his part. I didn’t think he would do it. Also upset with NASCAR for not putting our a more appropriate punishment. They should of suspended him from a race or 2. That “parking” with 4 laps was nothing NASCAR thinks it was a big deal when it was nothing really. A car 156 laps down wrecks a car potentially vying for a win and gets away with a slap is ridiculous.
On the other hand with Keselowski driving this way maybe we all don’t see the big picture. Maybe we aren’t seeing what we could be seeing. What I’m getting at is this is sort of the same scenario with the one and only, Dale Earnhardt Sr., the Intimidator. Some hated him for his driving style being too aggressive and others loved it. Maybe we are just seeing a Dale Earnhardt style driver upon us. But some are revolting now because we are in modern day NASCAR where we have come to accept the modern day NASCAR where you can’t wreck anyone.
Welcome back to the good ol’ days
Toby Gerhart: The Thunder to Jamaal Charles' Lightning.
True and Valuable Quotes:
"Charles In Charge"
"Defense Wins Championships"
"The Battle is Won and Lost in the Trenches"
(which for the most part we are currently loosing).
You comparing Brad Keselowski to Dale Earnhardt...
Made me throw up in my mouth a little.
Sure, he drove aggressively and some people ended up with wrecked race cars because of it… but that is as far as the comparison goes in my opinion.
I will agree with you though, that we seem to be inching back closer in the direction of those ‘good ole days’.
Not comparing him by any means.
He doesn’t even have a season under his belts why in the hell would I do that? I said he has a style similar to Sr. I’m an Earnhardt family fan jr sr, whoever. I would never compare kese to sr.
Toby Gerhart: The Thunder to Jamaal Charles' Lightning.
True and Valuable Quotes:
"Charles In Charge"
"Defense Wins Championships"
"The Battle is Won and Lost in the Trenches"
(which for the most part we are currently loosing).
Good ol' Days
Only with the exception of the chase. Hate it love it hate it love it. I hate it because Jimmie wins it all the time it seems. Love it, only when someone i like is leading and driving away. But I know if Dale was in top 12 and couldn’t catch the points leader i’d want the chase so he could have a shot.
It has it’s pros and cons.
Toby Gerhart: The Thunder to Jamaal Charles' Lightning.
True and Valuable Quotes:
"Charles In Charge"
"Defense Wins Championships"
"The Battle is Won and Lost in the Trenches"
(which for the most part we are currently loosing).
What do you mean by this comment?
But some are revolting now because we are in modern day NASCAR where we have come to accept the modern day NASCAR where you can’t wreck anyone.
Today's Nascar
has become soft. recent years if you’ve wrecked someone, intentionally or unintentionally, you become the bad guy. the one everyone hates. wrecking had become unofficially illegal. atleast to fans.
Toby Gerhart: The Thunder to Jamaal Charles' Lightning.
True and Valuable Quotes:
"Charles In Charge"
"Defense Wins Championships"
"The Battle is Won and Lost in the Trenches"
(which for the most part we are currently loosing).
Then why have you lost all respect for Edwards?
If you want it to revert back to the “good ol’ days” wouldn’t you want these feuds?
Why is it classless?
If someone messed with you while you were at work would you not get back at them? This is their life. I, for one, would be pissed if I spent all of my time on something and it was ruined time and time again by the same person.
Love/Hate
I don’t want to see anyone get hurt, but I liked the payback and I like this “rivalry”.
Yet, I think the penalty is too light, for the simple fact that Edwards admitted what he was trying do…
I don’t know how NASCAR normally grades these type of things (I haven’t been a fan of the sport long enough), but dock him points and suspend him for three races, or dock him points and make him start at the ass end of the field for three races, or something…
I've always considered writing the most hateful kind of work ... I suspect its a bit like fucking, which is only fun for amateurs. -Hunter Thompson
by RockyRippleColtsFan on Mar 11, 2010 5:56 PM EST reply actions
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